Thread regarding Bank of New York Mellon Corp. layoffs

Some things to expect when your expecting to be laid off from BNYM

So it has come to this, It’s not a matter of IF you get laid off, it’s a matter of WHEN you get laid off. The writing is on the wall and you know it. It’s just a matter of time. There’s not a damn thing you can do about any of it, because this is simply the reality at BNYM. If they can’t automate you, they will outsource you, or replace you with cheaper labor, so just flat out get rid of you. They will give your job to the poor surviving soul who remains in your dept. That person is already doing the job of 4 other people who were let go from the last round of layoffs. So at this point what difference does it make to ask that person to do more? It just doesn’t matter anymore. The only thing that matters now is waiting for them to tell you that you don’t have to work for this awful company anymore. Such is life at BNYM.

I wanted to touch on a few details regarding being laid off from BNYM. The most important detail is severance. First of all, let me preface by saying I am a US based employee. I don’t know how these details differ for EMEA or APAC. I don’t even know if these details differ between Texas, Florida, New York, or Pittsburgh. I only know what I know, ya know?

Here is what I do know. Most BNYM employees do not get a severance when they are laid off. Some middle and upper managers probably get a severance, but your average run of the mill BNYM employee does not get a severance of any kind. Before you start to panic, let me tell you that you DO get something called a Sub payment, but there’s a huge difference between sub payments and a traditional severance.

When you are given a traditional severance, the company usually offers an amount of compensation based on time and title. Then they cut you a check for that amount and send you on your way. If you think that’s what’s gonna happen when you get laid off, you are gonna be very disappointed. I’m sure you have the coworker running around your dept telling everyone you get a severance of 2 weeks pay for every year you work there. Yes this is true!!!!!! You do get that, but it’s not a severance!!!! True severance pay usually doesn’t have many strings attached. You won’t get a severance, you will get sub payments, and sub payments are conditional. If you don’t meet the conditions, then you won’t get either some, or all of it. Your coworker doesn’t tell you that little detail.

Sub payments is supplemental unemployment pay that is paid to you when you are involuntary laid off. You must be eligible for regular unemployment in order to receive sub payments. You must continue to remain eligible for unemployment to continue receiving the sub payments. That’s where the biggest challenge is for someone whose been at BNY Mellon for many years. Your sub payments are paid to you on the 1st and 15th if every month, until the full amount that’s owed to you is collected. The longer you’ve been with the company, the longer it will take you to collect all the sub payments. If you go back to work, or if you are self employed, or if any other event happens that’s disqualifies you from regular unemployment, then you also forfeit whatever remaining sub payments you haven’t collected yet. So if you find another job and you only collected half of your so called “severance”, then you will forfeit the rest. This is what I mean when I say “it’s not a severance.” The one bit of good news, the sub payments are not income and so they are not taxed the same as a regular paycheck.

Some other details to touch on real quick: you have the option to keep your medical benefits until you’ve collected all of your sub payments. After the sub payments run out, you’ll have the option to pay for your benefits via COBRA, or you can buy an Obamacare plan, or you just won’t have insurance until you go back to work. COBRA is very expensive. I am a single female not married no kids and my Cobra benefits run over $560 a month. This would be higher if I had dependents. Cobra is only good for 18 months after you enroll. So at the end of 18 months you loose it.

Regarding your 401k. You can’t touch it for 30 days after your termination date. But then after those 30 days are up, I suggest that you go get your money and put it somewhere else. Get yourself either a traditional or Roth IRA set it up via fidelity, or Vanguard, or through your local bank. Get your 401k out of VOYA/State street and roll it into your own IRA account. If you already have an existing IRA account set up, then you should be able to roll your BNYM 401k into the existing IRA without penalty.

I’m not trying to scare people, or disparage BNYM in any way. I’m just giving you what I feel is a realistic view on the matter. You have worked for BNYM for many many years, and for whatever reason they let you go. Why would you keep your 401k money with them after you are gone? You don’t work there anymore! It’s your money, go get it, and simply put it somewhere else.

So those are the biggest details I can think of regarding leaving BNYM. Please take everything I say with a grain of salt, because by the time you read this, it could all change. But I hope this helps give you an idea of what to expect.

Lastly let me say to you: do not let fear, anxiety and paranoia control your career or your life. There is nothing wrong with you. The only thing that is wrong is where you work. Don’t just be happy to have a job if that job is sh– and you are treated as such. You have 2 good feet and you deserve to be happy above all else. You march. Forever forward, left foot first. Don’t look back. Move onto something where you have a voice, where you are valued, and where you can be happy.

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| 3451 views | | 21 replies (last September 13, 2019) | Reply
Post ID: @OP+10Rmxnlq

21 replies (most recent on top)

Reply to 5-fig. Though you’re intent was likely well-intentioned, your assertion that ERISA does not apply to Defined Contribution plans is patently incorrect. I find it ironic that you said you found it hard to believe that people posting incorrect information worked at a custody bank. Though different than a Defined Benefit plan (funding method, lack of promised benefit at normal retirement age, plan sponsor financial obligation, etc) ERISA rules apply, such as Non-Discrimination rules, disclosures and statements, etc. Perhaps you were thinking of Non-ERISA 403b plans (mostly public school systems), which do fall outside ERISA (there are also 403b ERISA plans but they are generally pretty uncommon). I have been specifically in the retirement plan space for over 20 years and have a good handle on this level of detail.

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Post ID: @auxi+10Rmxnlq

There is no such thing as a Voya “no fee index fund” in the 401K or out of it. Advise reading the prospectus for every fund in which you invest. In addition to learning the fees you will learn where they go, for example, how much you’re paying for their marketing vs paying for running the fund.

Think of it this way....if Voya offers “no fee index funds” then how does Vanguard deliver higher returns for the exact same index funds? Answer: compare and read the prospectuses of the equivalent funds. You’ll find that Vanguard spends less running their funds as well as less on marketing them

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Post ID: @5pqi+10Rmxnlq

Ok, it is very difficult to believe that these people actually work in a custody bank and are so completely unaware of fiduciary responsibilities and ERISA, the Employee Retirement Income Security Act. I doubt they work at BONY.

ERISA applies to Defined Benefit Plans, not to Defined Contribution Plans. The recently terminated and frozen legacy pension and cash Plans in which which many current employees and the vast majority of retirees participate are defined benefit plans. BONY has risk there and has a fiduciary responsibility to manage those funds to pay the benefits. This is why they were ended and frozen.

The 401K is a defined contribution plan, where the employee and the employer both make contributions. The employee bears the risk and responsibility of managing their investments choosing their investment mix. BONY has NO fiduciary responsibility under ERISA for the 401K.

The demise of traditional pensions and their replacement with defined contribution plans represents a massive shift of fish and obligation from employer to employee. So, in that light, I personally suggest that you learn a bit more about VOYA and in particular their expense ratios in all but the simple index funds. If you think that the VOYA online retirement models are what you can count on, you need to understand that you are the the closest thing to a fiduciary in making that happen.

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Post ID: @5fig+10Rmxnlq

Also, save your babble about my word omissions and typos. I'm writing this with my thumb, and those errors don't change the fact that I am smarter than you.

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Post ID: @3irz+10Rmxnlq

For the most part I agree with the consensus that this well written post. However I agree with the post about not rushing to move your 401k. I hate this company more than most, but I won't let that hatred influence what us best for my money.

Some of you id–ts are c-apping on someone for giving sound advice. Please, by all means, post a name of a brokerage company that has not been fined or sued that offers me no fee index fund choices comparable to what I have.

Save your Voya shill comments as they are way off base. The only thing I care about is getting the best return on my million dollar portfolio.

Bitterness should have no influence on your financial decisions.

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Post ID: @3ayl+10Rmxnlq

I got laid off a year ago I did get a sub package for 6 months I was also able to collect simultaneously Mass Massachusetts unemployment and maintained my health insurance for the six month. Good luck to all

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Post ID: @3smj+10Rmxnlq

@2ywz - Obviously you are a TROLL, and one that can't read either! The fiduciary responsibility is that of BNYM Management. Your posts show just how much of dunce you really are, but you can't fix stupid. You were probably riffed on the first let go.....good riddance to you.

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Post ID: @2pnk+10Rmxnlq

Also didn't BNYMellon's auditors just pay a massive fine in Europe for misstating BNYMellon's financials or failing to catch something. Not sure accounting/auditors are what they once were.

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Post ID: @2oox+10Rmxnlq

1rmr - you must be a paid VOYA Shill, talking about the fiduciary advantage of using VOYA. Even the most casual financial investor knows the stories of VOYA irregularities and the irregularities in its previous incarnation, ING.

https://www.smeissner.com/meissner-associates-investigates-arrested-financial-planner-frederick-e-monroe-jr-and-voya-financial-advisors-formerly-ing-bank-for-allegedly-engaging-in-ponzi-scheme-theft-of-client-funds-and-fa/

https://www.journalofaccountancy.com/issues/2014/aug/fraud-20149862.html

https://stockbrokerfraud.com/voya-financial-failure-to-supervise/

https://www.wealthmanagement.com/regulation-compliance/voya-pay-1-million-penalty-cybersecurity-failures

https://www.frankowskifirm.com/voya-pay-3m-fine-disclosure-violations/

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Post ID: @2ywz+10Rmxnlq

What about restricted stock? Does that become available, does it stay and continue to best, or is it lost?

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Post ID: @1pqa+10Rmxnlq

you’re

And you are lucky they don’t lay off for bad grammar (or typo).

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Post ID: @1srd+10Rmxnlq

@1kth - Let me clarify, the statement you receive is a quarterly/annual attestment to the value of your investments held in the 401k plan. That they are required to provide to you. You are correct, a funding statement is provided for the pension plan that is frozen.

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Post ID: @1uec+10Rmxnlq

You don't get a funding statement for 401k plans as they are not a liability of the company.

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Post ID: @1kth+10Rmxnlq

@1pqh - NOT a Voya employee, nor am I associated with any internal/external companies in the investment industry. Rather, am an informed individual putting the truth first before a personal vendetta or agenda such as yourself. The first line offered up by you is to make false assumptions while the post I put up is FACTUAL. You let your hatred of being let go be the basis of your decision making. To each their own.

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Post ID: @1kow+10Rmxnlq

1rmr - you must be a VOYA employee. I’m sure VOYA is hemorrhaging accounts from all of the recent layoffs. I decided to consolidate my BNYM 401k into my existing outside brokerage account. Frankly there was no hesitation in my decision. The thought of leaving any of my money with anyone having anything to do with BNYM makes me feel nauseated. I was escorted to the door earlier this year and no one said that they would really appreciate me leaving my 401k there. Thank goodness we do have a choice to take it or leave it, as it is truly a personal decision. Fortunately for me, it was a easy decision.

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Post ID: @1pqh+10Rmxnlq

The OP gave the advice of moving the 401K plan to an IRA. Not so fast......these are the benefits of leaving the 401K with Voya: 401K money is protected by ERISA (isn't that a mouthful?). ERISA is the Employee Retirement Income Security Act protects your plans assets by requiring the people (BNYM management) who have responsibility for administration of the plan to be subjected to fiduciary responsibilities. No IRA provider is currently required by law to act in a fiduciary manner. Second, assets held in a 401k protected by ERISA are "off-limits" in the event you are sued in court, with an IRA (rollover or otherwise) those assets are protected only up to certain limits and only if the state in which you reside has those protections written into passed laws. Third, if you hold your 401K investments in the "index funds" investments, those investments are nearly free with the exception of a ultra-small administrative expense of 1-2 basis points. In a world, where accumulating retirement funds requires you to save, why would you move your money to another provider and pay them more? Every penny you save, is a penny in your retirement account, every basis point you pay away, is money lost forever!! Fourth, and I think many here will like this......going back to the fiduciary aspect, BNYM is on the hook not to misplace your account records, to make you aware of changes, to mail you an annual statement of funding, etc. Fifth, you should only move the account if you have found a much better alternative than the above and want to roll the plan over or you simply want to simplify your financial lives, costs be damned. Since the current plan is well thought out and you have a large enough menu of investments to satisfy nearly anyone except the salivating financial adviser at your local bank, brokerage or accounting firm (looking longingly at you for a shot of earning huge commissions on reeling you in), the reasons for staying in the plan outweigh the reasons listed by the OP.

Good Luck in what ever you choose.

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Post ID: @1rmr+10Rmxnlq

We need more informative posts like this on this forum. Bravo.

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Post ID: @hfj+10Rmxnlq

Thanks all for these posts. This goes a long way towards explaining why there appear to be such differences in the packages which people receive upon displacement.

People would be less stressed if there was a BNYM HR location where these policies could be read. A nice slow read to understand your situation beforehand is far more humane than a surprise visit to a conference room, shellshocked and walked out with a stack of papers as your brain is reeling.

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Post ID: @lrn+10Rmxnlq

Regarding severance verse SUB. Not sure but this is what I saw from mine and my co-worker experience. Ill who I know in IT got SUB, however who was separated from business area got severance. People who got severance don't have to call 2 times per month to confirm their unemployment, they pay different taxes including FICA (medicare and SS) however if they find job severance payment will be stopped as well (at least this is what my friend told me).

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Post ID: @gib+10Rmxnlq

Dear Mellon/Scaife family this place is destroying your reputation real time, and is also hurting good people and the great city of Pittsburgh, please do the necessary and fire the management of this place before it’s too late.

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Post ID: @xud+10Rmxnlq

Thank you very much for such a good post to those that are affected, including myself. Your encouragement lifts my spirit up a bit to this no good deed goes unpunished treatment. It was such a surreal feeling when they show you the door.

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Post ID: @stt+10Rmxnlq

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