Aside from the fact that most in BNY can't pronounce Wroclaw, surely it's time to question this place?
Are the staff immune from layoffs?
12 replies (most recent on top)
Poland is rad!
I once asked a manager when he needed to fill a position in his team and said he’d be hiring someone in India:
“Why don’t you hire an American”?
He just smirked…
"Penny wise, pound foolish"
We've been outsourcing to India for at least the past ten years. I'd say of the people I've dealt with, 20% are excellent, willing to learn, and take notes. The rest cost so much time and effort it's just not worth bothering.
We finally got a break after a few years when management demanded to know why so many projects were over budget. When they did some real analysis, they found that all the extra time and money was us fixing all the code coming from India. They stopped pushing the terrible coders on us and we kept the good ones. Unfortunately, as someone else said, the good ones tend to move on or move up.
Right now I'm dealing with one whose code looks like something my cat wrote by stepping on the keyboard. Every single thing has to be reworked when I get it, and it's not worth trying to get this person to fix it, because then I end up fixing it again.
There's also quite a language barrier with some people. I can only communicate by Teams or email, and even then you can tell they just don't get what you're talking about (and vice versa). As for program notes, well, good luck using grep to search for strings, because the spelling gets creative.
If I had to pick, I'd prefer Poland over India. Poland isn't as cheap as India, but you can understand them better and the turnover isn't high like India. I think there are still people caps for Poland and India though. I'm not sure if that will change in the future though. But honestly, Poland is barely cheaper than Manchester and still not far away from other locations like Texas, Delaware, or even Pittsburgh.
I spent 3 weeks in Warsaw and loved it. Krakow was super interesting as well. Awesome historical place. Food was great and cheap!
Highly recommended!
- You get a mixed bag of developers from Pune and Chennai.
- The smart, intelligent, eager and creative folks use this as a spring board to move to US or other organizations. They do not stay for more than 3-4 years.
- Others, the moment they become TL/PLs or Senior Developers (at a very young age, late 20s most likely) they stop coding.Transform themselves as another layer of fat. Worst is their desire to "have their say" which results in unwanted delays (their ego and desire to feel important further adds to the misery).
End Result -> One has a bigger team and a higher level of expectations and demands to be met but there are the same number of working hands (with additional layers of fat to get through). The working hands are actually raw developers (the junior most) and one goes through the same cycles of training them. Frustrated by this , one stops asking them to do any work.
On paper one has N person team but the work is done by less than 33% (more or less) and the remaining are "supervisors" who exist to make remarks on Jira stories.
Now-a-days we hire more contractors who have the same attitude (and once they figure out how dysfunctional we are) they sail through with zero delivery. I had 3 contractors and the number of lines they contributed costs like $3,000 per true line of code.
Add to that the WFH scheme and the RTO being twisted they are the best workers one can get !
(12 days a quarter is treated like community service sentence - they visit Chennai or Pune for 12 days continuously and then go back their home towns for the remaining 2 1/2 months with unreliable network connectivity and power outage)
But they are cheap (in terms of pay ). One wonders what BNYM has truly delivered in terms of products in the last 2 - 3 years. Unfortunately their desire to get into crypto was bad timing.
High Quality is pushing it… there are some exceptions, but in general a lot of the work done in pune is not very good and requires correction. It is cheap labor though.
you can get an automation expert in pune that only costs 22k a year. yeah, that cheap.
Both Wroclaw and Pune offer super cheap high quality well educated labor coupled with a work ethic.
In other words, all of the qualities that we used to have in the U.S.A.
D-mb question. Low cost locations.
Yes, they are; same with Pune, for the most part- super cheap labor. End of story.